Super Smash Bros. for 3DS/Wii U Community

SoraJehJehKeyblade2

02/04/2016 6:00 AM ·Spoilers

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Sheik, Zero Suit Samus, and Rosalina NERFED?

They are each somewhat lighter. They're a bit harder to combo, but you can KO them a bit easier. What do you think? Nerf or buff?

Yeahs2

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@Naruto: You can have the best Ganondorf player in the world play against a fairly good ZSS, Sheik, or Rosalina player and Ganondorf would likely still lose the majority of the time. Characters most certainly have competitive viability; there's a reason tier lists exist.

Yeahs0

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@Goldonhead: I personally feel it would be far better to just buff characters instead of nerfing top-tier threats. Ideally, every character should have enough competitive tools in their arsenal to be viable at high levels of competitive play. I feel it would be better for the metagame overall to buff the low/bottom tiers a LOT while buffing the mid tiers a little to make the game more balanced.

Yeahs1

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For example, Bowser Jr is one of my mains. I would much prefer he got more tools like better frame data, safer options on-shield, less susceptibility to gimps, actual follow-ups from throws, etc than asking for top-tier characters to be nerfed. Nerfing characters only hinders someone's play experience, while buffing characters (to a reasonable extent) benefits people's experiences.

Yeahs1

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Keep in mind, I'm not saying bottom tiers should become OP. I'm just saying I'd prefer to see something like BlazBlue back in the Continuum Shift days. There was basically just 2 characters in S tier, 3 or 4 in A tier, 1 in C tier, and everyone else was B tier. The gaps between the tiers were pretty negligible, so basically the entire cast was viable aside from that 1 girl in C tier.

Yeahs1

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Yes, some were a bit more viable than others, but that's unavoidable. What matters most is that the majority of the cast was considered viable. SSB4 is actually surprisingly close to achieving this, as most of the mid tiers are still fairly viable (especially when compared to Melee or Brawl's mid tiers). That said, some of the low/bottom tiers still need quite a bit of work.

Yeahs1

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Dude. Goldonhead. I DROPPED Sheik a long time ago. Look at my Anther's page. I may not be a Top Tier main (which you seem to love shaming), but I do think you should learn to adapt like everyone else. Nerfing a character just makes the game less fun for the main of that character. I should know because I (still) main Luigi.

Yeahs1

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Tier lists exist because not everyone can pick a character on their own, and how good a character is and competitive play are 2 different things.

Yeahs0

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Alright fine, Luma gets it the way a lot. Also, Yoshi needs a big time nerf, he's some what op.

Yeahs1

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Tier lists shouldn't exist because each character is balanced (expect for Yoshi), so it's your choice to main a character, but that's my opinion.

Yeahs0

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Yeah, no. Yoshi isn't OP. Maybe if you played something other than For Glory...

Yeahs0

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Even ON For Glory, he's not that good. The only reason to complain about Yoshi is if SOMEHOW you keep getting hit by his D-air... which you really shouldn't be getting hit by that often.

Yeahs0

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And the reason I shame top-tier mains is because, most of the time, it's likely they've never touched a single Nintendo game in their lives. I won't shame a Shiek player who likes OoT or a Rosalina player who likes SMG, because they didn't choose those characters BECAUSE OF the tiers.

Yeahs0

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Well, I know you didn't know this, but I do pick characters just because I like them. Luigi dead last in Smash 64, and I even main him there. Because Luigi is my favorite character from any video game. Ganondorf is dead last in Brawl, and I still use him. Because when my brother, my cousin and I first saw him in Melee, we worked so hard to get him from that event and it caused us to love him.

Yeahs1

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*Luigi is

Yeahs1

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That is also why I still main Luigi to this day. Despite his nerf. I also main Ness cause I liked him in Melee, and needed a replacement for Lucas before he was re-announced as DLC.

Yeahs1

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@Naruto: I don't think you understand what exactly a tier list is. It's compiled from things like matchups, frame data, and tournament results. Tier lists aren't some arbitrary popularity contest; they're made from actual data and results, then compiled into a list. While you may take issue with some particular placements, saying that all characters are equally viable is just ludicrous.

Yeahs0

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There's a reason why characters like Sheik, RosaLuma, and ZSS place highly; they are competitively more viable than most of the cast. If you think of the characters as weapons you'd take into battle: the top tiers are like firearms, the mid tiers are like bows & arrows, and the low/bottom tiers are like slings. While it's possible for a good sling-user to beat a gun-user, it's not very likely.

Yeahs0

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While this analogy is a bitof an overexageration, it still illustrates the point I'm trying to make. The tiers are there to show people which characters are objectively more effective at optimal levels. If you happen to like a mid tier character (bow & arrow), then by all means use them. Just be aware that you are somewhat self-handicapping yourself if you plan to play competitively.

Yeahs0

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*Whoops. I meant to address this towards Pacmaniac, not Naruto*

Yeahs0

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@Goldonhead: So you're basically arguing that you can't play as a character unless you've played their game before? Then by that logic, very few people outside of Japan could use Lucas or more niche characters like Shulk, Marth, Roy, etc. People can use whichever character they want. If people choose to main top-tiers it's because they actually want to WIN; there's nothing wrong with that.

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